The way I looked at it, you’re taking a dispute between A and B, and punching C in the eye. It’s impossible not to be insulting party C with this action.
National Anthem
- Thread starter gchaneyjr
- Start date
The way I looked at it, you’re taking a dispute between A and B, and punching C in the eye. It’s impossible not to be insulting party C with this action.
We’re always going to disagree on this lol. I don’t think that we are punching C in the eye, a belief that a lot of C holds as well. However, I understand that people could be offended. My whole point is that the protest is working, and that if the rhetoric of those who are offended changed, then I think players would stop kneeling. If you are offended, enact your right to peacefully protest by not watching. But the idea that the players are “sons of bitches who need to leave the country” (as a reminder, those are our President’s words) because they are kneeling is only going to cause them to kneel more. Hating them into standing is not going to work.
I actually do NOT understand how anyone can be offended by people protesting unlawful acts that lead to death in the African American community. To me it is like saying you are offended because you do not think this is a problem where the evidence proves there is a problem. The protest has absolutely nothing to do with our allegiance to the flag. That's largely a red herring argument. Not one person that has gotten on a knee is telling you they disrespect the flag. It is offensive because someone tells you that you should be offended. Not because you are actually offended. Does Jerry Jones wearing his hat during the anthem offend you? Probably not or not at least that anyone here has expressed.
My protest is I quit watching and I don’t travel to the games anymore or buy merchandise, I used to travel to at least one game a year. It used to be driven by anger, now I just don’t care, I’ve found other things to do,if you knew me,it would be hard to believe, the Dolphins have been a big par of my life since the age of five.
I hate to be the one to tell you that it has nothing to do with being liberal or socialist etc. sadly many of you are spouting the words and supporting the actions of men who avoided military service during wartime. If your scream about look at me people these are the ones you should complain about. People have rights and when those rights are violated the have the right to protest. Let’s move on from polarizing politics and get down to some football.
Simply not true. Myself and almost everyone I know that has been in combat disagree with your statement.
Kgfamu said:
Joe you don't have this same problem when its breast cancer awareness month. You dont tell the players to save all the Pink for the corners, radio, clubs, and park. LOL the contradiction.
Joe Toth said:
I appreciate your point of view @Kgfamu. The difference in your example is it was an agreed upon action by the NFL, NFLPA and the Commisoner (forget the public at this point). It was not an action suddenly decided by one, or a few or any minority percentage of players to participate in something that was their own cause.
BTW, you may not know, but participating in the BCAM activities is totally voluntary, a player isn't forced to wear pink. However, I believe everyone participates....gladly. Maybe because, unlike the human race, breast cancer is color blind.
I’m not sure what you’re saying. But for myself, “The only thing that I know is that I don’t know anything”. What I think I may know, however, is that there is no reliable source for news. It’s all editorial bias.
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Listen rookie i agree there is a bit of contradiction here but I pay for this so deal with it. I look at this very serious and my military in my family were grandfathers in WW1 and WWII that came home. I respect everyone who fought for me and gave me the opportunity to work my ass off and have a pretty damn good life. Thats right...... a human died to give me personally the opportunities that i have had and for that I am very thankful and respectful.
I am telling you right now that if this team allowed disrespect to my country and to the men and women who have fought for it you would never see me at another game. I have been a season ticket holder for many years, many bowl games from 1987 to today. If the program allows disrespect.....poof i will be gone so you can wish for that.
Gary
It's news. Not gonna happen. The media isn't there to please people that don't think they should be protesting. The purpose of the media is to report the news.
I think his point is that it’s not news. 2 out of 2000 players kneeled that night. One tenth of one percent. Both the media and politicians are making this a bigger issue than it needs to be for their own personal gain.
Of course it is news. Even if 1 one player kneeled like it was news when Colin was the only person that kneeled. It isn't the number of people that kneel that matters. It is why they are kneeling that is what matters.
And the same bunch that is crucifying players for taking a knee in protest will watch thousands march on the WH with swastikas chanting supremacist BS and be fine with it. Haters gonna' hate.
You’re boys are the ones acting like NAZI’s, attacking and maligning anyone who disagrees with them, try and bring something else besides liberal talking points.
Hecht the officers don't agree with you but nice try. Go take a look at their facebook pages. This all started with Kapernick and Black Lives Matter and attacking the police. I really thought you were a good guy until you comments on this subject. You are a loser.
Straight from the 45 playbook.
Accuse the other guy of exactly what you're doing.
Trick question. Who's "acting like NAZI’s"?
People having a political debate or marchers waving swaztikas?
Take your time . . .
BTW, I'm a Reg. Ind.
"You’re boys" ?!! . . . smh . . . . .
Trust me, revenues might be up but this issue is about money. Just because revenues are up doesnt mean the owners dont think their profit margin could be even higher without the protests. There are many polls out there that show that in addition to other factors the protests have been one of the biggest factors that have negatively affected ratings. Many owners have come out and said they have gotten tons of emails from season ticket holders threatening to cancel because of the protests and those owners testified in depositions that those emails were part of the reason why they wouldnt take Kaeperneck. The reason why the NFL originally proposed the new rule of banning protests had nothing to do with a sense of patriotism.
This issue is going to come to a head very soon, especially with the Broward PBA now coming out and asking its members to boycott the Fins. There are going to be more to follow.
Speaking of polls....here are a couple that show that a good amount of fans are losing interest in the NFL because of the protests.
http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...-protests-no-1-reason-viewers-tuned-nfl-games
https://www.broadcastingcable.com/n...tests-top-reasons-nfl-ratings-declines-171585
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If anyone is acting like a NAZI it’s you, you were first to call people racist and NAZI’s. Apparently you can’t comprehend someone can disagree with you on this subject and not be racist, sad, because judging from your AVATAR your not in your teens.
First and foremost, the issue that they are bringing awareness to is being talked about. People may not like it, but the goal of bringing awareness to systemic racism has been accomplished.
Second, more time/energy is being spent between minority groups and communities, including police forces, to find a common ground and solutions. If everyone would take a break from CNN/Fox and the bullshit, you would be able to see the amount of work being done by NFL players. They’re meeting with police forces, community leaders, etc. Donating time and money to help.
I’ll say it again, 2 out of 2000 players kneeled the other night. I think that shows that most players want to stand for the anthem and feel like progress is being made. It’s only when they’re met with vitriol and hate that they start kneeling again.
You ducked my question. I didn’t ask what was being done by the nfl players. I asked how kneeling was helping. I’ll answer... it doesn’t. Kneeling for the national anthem was originally done because the claim was to show focus on America’s history of slavery. That was the original claim. We have taken huge steps since 1865 in the right direction. Kneeling for the anthem is a slap in the face to every person who serves our country. It has nothing to do with “systemic racism” which is nothing more than a buzz word from msnbc. I’d even argue there’s been a greater rise in black nationalism and black supremacist groups in the last 10 years than any other group.
Here’s my solution... stop dividing people! Your left wing party loves to play identity politics and is now starting to get their ass handed to them because people are starting realizentheyve been used by the Democratic Party for generations. Democrats: the party of Jim Crowe, KKK, slavery & have not answered for any of it.
I didn’t duck anything. Kneeling was meant to bring awareness to an issue. Awareness was brought to the issue. Awareness then led to more people working together to solve said issue. Your interpretation of the issue is wrong. If you took a second to actually listen to what the players are saying you would see what they are protesting.
And it’s not identity politics. For all our greatness, the treatment of black people and minorities in general over the course of time has been this country’s biggest stain. It’s a general problem. It’s not an indictment on you personally, so stop taking it so personally.
Kneeling for the anthem was suggested by a service member and 62% of service members support NFL athletes right to protest and don’t have an issue with it.
But here’s the thing, it shouldn’t be divisive. You find it to be divisive because you get offended for a group of people who are generally not offended. It’s divisive because politicians and news outlets on both sides portray it to be divisive in order to secure votes and revenue. That’s it. Instead of getting offended like the snowflakes you despise so much, take a step back and recognize that a large demographic of our country lives a much different version of the American Dream due to a wide variety of issues that affect them differently than they do white people. Again, it’s not a personal attack on you or anyone for that matter.
It’s not that I take it personally, but I see more mistreatment of white people by Hispanics and black people than I see of white people vs anyone else combined. Especially the elderly. Working in law enforcement I’ve been called every name in the book and not because I did anything wrong. Just some ignorant ass people. I’ve seen the rise of the New Black Panther Party and the lefts embracing of their ideals. These people are no different than the KKK and skinheads your party loves to portray as the average republican, even though the KKK was founded by Democrats. It’s absolutely Identity politics and the fact you deny this is laughable.
As for being offended? Hell yes I’m offended, unlike the left I don’t need the media outlets to tell me what to think just like you’re trying to do right now.
He answered your question as directly as it could it possibly be answered.
That doesn’t mean it’s positive. Being divisive and disrespecting our armed forces isn’t talking about issues. It’s being an asshole. Big difference!
Why are you offended then?
Bro, I’m arguing against identity politics. Both the Democrats and the Republicans are playing up the anthem issue. I’m not denying that at all.
Systemic racism has nothing to do with identity politics. Do me a favor as a fellow Tennessean, keep an open mind and read this article. It’s a list of 14 examples of systemic racism. It’s not cross burnings and lynchings, it’s things like the fact that black people are more likely to be arrested for having weed in their car when pulled over than white people who are pulled over when having weed in their car.
https://www.commondreams.org/views/...es-systemic-racism-us-criminal-justice-system
You think protesting racism and police brutality is disrespectful and divisive ? Interesting.
Not at all. But is it hard to understand why many feel that the method of protest, where the object of the protest is held sacred by those many, doesn't fit the agenda in their minds, and therefore dont want hear or see about it at a sporting event which they pay for? After all, the NBA has had a long standing policy for the players to honor the flag during the Anthem.
In fairness the kneeling wouldn't receive much coverage if those who objected to it didn't kick up such a fuss, which in turn generates yet more drama and coverage.
You act surprised that those who objected to it kicked up such a fuss. You dont think Kaepernick knew before he did it he would get the type of reaction he has gotten? While I agree that Trump shouldnt be calling for the firing or benching of those players and stay out of it, and his rhetoric on the issue poured more gas on the flame, make no mistake about it, Kaepernick knew what he was doing would spark outrage.
Should it spark outrage though ? The kneelers have repeatedly explained that they are doing it to protest institutionalized racism and police brutality - and are in no way attempting to disrespect veterans or any of the other reasons some people are citing.
Quote from Kaepernick
It should also be noted that this sort of protest didn't start with him. Its been going on since the Mexico City Olympics in 68 to the 1980 Olympics in Moscow when a Polish pole vaulter protested Soviet Communism by making a similar gesture, to Chris Jackson not standing for the anthem in the mid 90s. Kaepernick is merely the latest in a long tradition of people using the anthem to protest discriminatory practices implicit in its symbolism.
That wasn’t the original narrative lmao....
Let’s entertain that for a minute though. Don’t bring up names like Michael Brown in that mix. Have there been cases of abuse? Yes there has. Is it commonplace? Hell no! Go back to your left wing groups, to include BLM, wanting to target all cops.:
This is what happens when you cry wolf all the damn time. When something real happens nobody wants to hear it.
The way Kaeperneck has conveyed his message, on multiple occasions, is that the racial injustice he was protesting is due to actions by a minority of police officers that went rouge. Many feel, as I do, that the actions of a few bad actors among the men and women in blue doesnt deserve impugning the flag.
On occasion Kaepernick has talked about the high incarceration rates of backs vs whites, but he is assuming, without evidence, that its widespread policy to lock someone up just because of their skin color. Sure, they're occasions where a minority of unethical officers do dirty crap to cause someone to be stripped of their liberty......but is that a refection on our society as a whole? Or a reflection on officers as a whole and that somehow Americans support this type of conduct? 20% of the officers in most big cities are made up of men or women who are black so I just dont see the causal relationship between the manner of his protest and what he is protesting. The flag does not represent just police officers. Also, Soviet Communism is a far cry from how people in this country are treated.
Kaepernick is very radical in his statements about police in general. He oftens makes statements impugning all officers and in his mind it seems like they're mostly all bad actors. I dont think the other players kneeling feel the same way Kaeperneck does towards police as a whole and I have to wonder if those other players kneeling really understand what Kaeperneck's motives were, or do they think, as portrayed in the media, that anger against kneeling are anti-black sentiments so that's why they do it or are pissed at the outrage against kneeling without really understanding Kaeperneck's mindset.
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You don't have to put what u did....but you don't protest the flag....this is dumb...you do it other ways...by going to Washington on his time...not on other ppls time...get it out of sports it doesn't belong
