Texas abortion law

[cortez55403]

No abortions after 6 weeks of pregnancy. No exceptions for rape or incest.

Private citizens may sue to enforce the law against violators. $10k damages to them.

Talk amongst yourselves.

 

[WillyFistergash]

No abortions after 6 weeks of pregnancy. No exceptions for rape or incest.

Private citizens may sue to enforce the law against violators. $10k damages to them.

Talk amongst yourselves.

Move to a new state if you don’t like the laws. Go back to California, Washington Oregon Virginia and New York if you want a 39 week abortion because you lost your job and can’t afford the kid.

 

[central17]

No abortions after 6 weeks of pregnancy. No exceptions for rape or incest.

Private citizens may sue to enforce the law against violators. $10k damages to them.

Talk amongst yourselves.

Cortez,
As a starting point for a civilized discussion on a very complex and difficult subject, do you support 3rd Trimester abortions?

 

[RJWwood]

Can someone explain why the OP started this thread?
Maybe he can

 

[RJWwood]

Move to a new state of you don’t like the laws. Go back to California, Washington Oregon Virginia and New York if you want a 39 month abortion because you lost your job and can’t afford the kid.

Only enough Cortez is a Californian...

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez,
As a starting point for a civilized discussion on a very complex and difficult subject, do you support 3rd Trimester abortions?

I don’t have an ideological position on your question. Rather, I defer to the judgment of the mother and her physician. I don’t think it’s any of my business.

Neither do I think that it’s the business of state government to interfere in this private decision. No exceptions for rape or incest? Absurd. Allowing private citizens to sue those who aid in abortions? Shades of “Handmaids Tale.”

Lastly, many of the Right on here argue for minimal government intervention and maximum personal freedom. I get that. This Texas law, however, represents a move to “Big
brother” government and maximum regulation of personal freedom. Why the hypocrisy?

 

[cortez55403]

Only enough Cortez is a Californian...

Thanks, as always, for your seering insight, RJ.

 

[RJWwood]

Can someone explain why the OP started this thread?
Maybe he can

Cortez...???

 

[RJWwood]

Thanks, as always, for your seering insight, RJ.

I often provide you my insight...you then fade away like the clean California air has faded away to pollution, and smoke.

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez...???

To stimulate debate on an emotional issue for many. Was that too complex for you to figure out on your own?

Are you going to enlighten us with your insight on the Texas legislation or just pop off from the safe sideline?

 

[miamimike]

Can someone explain why the OP started this thread?
Maybe he can

To show the lunacy of a Repub controlled state like Texas!

 

[central17]

I don’t have an ideological position on your question. Rather, I defer to the judgment of the mother and her physician. I don’t think it’s any of my business.

Neither do I think that it’s the business of state government to interfere in this private decision. No exceptions for rape or incest? Absurd. Allowing private citizens to sue those who aid in abortions? Shades of “Handmaids Tale.”

Lastly, many of the Right on here argue for minimal government intervention and maximum personal freedom. I get that. This Texas law, however, represents a move to “Big
brother” government and maximum regulation of personal freedom. Why the hypocrisy?

Cortez,
Does that little thing in the mom's tummy, that at six months if not earlier has fingers, toes, eyes, ears, nose, a heartbeat and an awareness of its surroundings, and likely could live and thrive if delivered, have a place in the discussion? Your "mother and physician" comment completely avoided that vital part of the conversation. Please provide your response as to the fetus part of the issue, then we can have a complete and informed discussion. Don't step in the ring if you are not ready to do battle.

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez,
Does that little thing in the mom's tummy, that at six months if not earlier has fingers, toes, eyes, ears, nose, a heartbeat and an awareness of its surroundings, and likely could live and thrive if delivered, have a place in the discussion? Your "mother and physician" comment completely avoided that vital part of the conversation. Please provide your response as to the fetus part of the issue, then we can have a complete and informed discussion. Don't step in the ring if you are not ready to do battle.

17,

The Texas legislation deals with embryos that are 6 weeks old. You completely avoided discussion of the legislation at hand. What is your reaction the new Texas law? Please stay on point.

You then started a second discussion of fetuses in the third trimester. Why is that relevant? I do not trust elected officials to impose their political views on the actions of mothers and their Dr.’s. No doubt the abortion of a viable fetus is a much more controversial and emotionally charged decision. I just don’t want the Texas legislature to make that call.

 

[RJWwood]

To stimulate debate on an emotional issue for many. Was that too complex for you to figure out on your own?

Are you going to enlighten us with your insight on the Texas legislation or just pop off from the safe sideline?

To stimulate debate on an emotional issue for many. Was that too complex for you to figure out on your own?

Are you going to enlighten us with your insight on the Texas legislation or just pop off from the safe sideline?

Cortez...yea I'll stay on the sideline on this one I'll admit I'm not up on Texas Legislation....and again, a very odd thread to start in a forum where the % of males is probably 98%..thread is a FAIL!...enjoy a good Merlot tonight...

 

[IbisRules07]

I don’t have an ideological position on your question. Rather, I defer to the judgment of the mother and her physician. I don’t think it’s any of my business.

Neither do I think that it’s the business of state government to interfere in this private decision. No exceptions for rape or incest? Absurd. Allowing private citizens to sue those who aid in abortions? Shades of “Handmaids Tale.”

Lastly, many of the Right on here argue for minimal government intervention and maximum personal freedom. I get that. This Texas law, however, represents a move to “Big
brother” government and maximum regulation of personal freedom. Why the hypocrisy?

Oh I don't know maybe because the unborn have the RIGHT TO LIFE and that is the first duty of gov to protect? Sorry "personal freedom" does not include a mother killing her baby.

 

[IbisRules07]

To show the lunacy of a Repub controlled state like Texas!

No insanity is calling killing a baby, a person to be, a choice and its just a woman comtrolling her body. THATS insane

 

[central17]

17,

The Texas legislation deals with embryos that are 6 weeks old. You completely avoided discussion of the legislation at hand. What is your reaction the new Texas law? Please stay on point.

You then started a second discussion of fetuses in the third trimester. Why is that relevant? I do not trust elected officials to impose their political views on the actions of mothers and their Dr.’s. No doubt the abortion of a viable fetus is a much more controversial and emotionally charged decision. I just don’t want the Texas legislature to make that call.

Cortez,
I would welcome a complete and spirited debate on the subject. The country actually needs to have a such a discussion on the subject of abortion. Maybe stop with the sloganing and get to medical and scientific details.

I would agree that six weeks is a little too restrictive. At least two missed periods to determine there is a pregnancy and a certain level of time for the woman and her doctor to assess and discuss would seem reasonable. Also to determine if there was a rape, incest or medical danger to the mother.

However for you to attempt to exclude discussion of the 2nd and 3rd trimester is intellectually dishonest and frankly a little "Chicken Shit" for someone who stated they want to start an intelligent debate. That is kind of like saying you want to discuss the Canes-Bama game but don't want to include OL and DL in the discourse.

I will provide a clear "yes" to the question of Is the morning after pill OK. Can you provide a simple yes or no as to if you are OK with a 9th month abortion of a viable baby by sticking sharp objects in the infant's brain, while officially still in the mothers body? Those are the starting points for a rational discussion. A lot of room in between to reach a compromise. I honestly believe think that a solution that 95% of the population agrees with is reachable. But just saying "I don't like the Texas bill" is small minded. This issue will only be solved by brave and intelligent people that are willing to try to find reasonable solutions.

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez,
I would welcome a complete and spirited debate on the subject. The country actually needs to have a such a discussion on the subject of abortion. Maybe stop with the sloganing and get to medical and scientific details.

I would agree that six weeks is a little too restrictive. At least two missed periods to determine there is a pregnancy and a certain level of time for the woman and her doctor to assess and discuss would seem reasonable. Also to determine if there was a rape, incest or medical danger to the mother.

However for you to attempt to exclude discussion of the 2nd and 3rd trimester is intellectually dishonest and frankly a little "Chicken Shit" for someone who stated they want to start an intelligent debate. That is kind of like saying you want to discuss the Canes-Bama game but don't want to include OL and DL in the discourse.

I will provide a clear "yes" to the question of Is the morning after pill OK. Can you provide a simple yes or no as to if you are OK with a 9th month abortion of a viable baby by sticking sharp objects in the infant's brain, while officially still in the mothers body? Those are the starting points for a rational discussion. A lot of room in between to reach a compromise. I honestly believe think that a solution that 95% of the population agrees with is reachable. But just saying "I don't like the Texas bill" is small minded. This issue will only be solved by brave and intelligent people that are willing to try to find reasonable solutions.

You’re bouncing from 3rd trimester, to 2nd, to 9 months with a sharp object in the brain to the morning after pill. In response:

Ok on first and second trimester as well as cases of rep, incest or danger to the mother. Shakier on third trimester and big no on sharp object to the brain in Month 9 (never heard of that one). Ok with morning after pill.

I tried to start a rational discussion on the Texas legislation. Namely,

*6 week deadline is absurd as you mentioned. Many women don’t know that they’re even pregnant at that point.
*no exception for rape or incest. Criminal. Sounds like a Taliban rule.
*private civil lawsuits with $ penalties against those who aid abortions? Crazy. Would create an vigilante industry for anti abortion zealots and Abortion ambulance chasers.

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez...yea I'll stay on the sideline on this one I'll admit I'm not up on Texas Legislation....and again, a very odd thread to start in a forum where the % of males is probably 98%..thread is a FAIL!...enjoy a good Merlot tonight...

Only females care about abortion? You are truly a piece of work.

 

[central17]

You’re bouncing from 3rd trimester, to 2nd, to 9 months with a sharp object in the brain to the morning after pill. In response:

Ok on first and second trimester as well as cases of rep, incest or danger to the mother. Shakier on third trimester and big no on sharp object to the brain in Month 9 (never heard of that one). Ok with morning after pill.

I tried to start a rational discussion on the Texas legislation. Namely,

*6 week deadline is absurd as you mentioned. Many women don’t know that they’re even pregnant at that point.
*no exception for rape or incest. Criminal. Sounds like a Taliban rule.
*private civil lawsuits with $ penalties against those who aid abortions? Crazy. Would create an vigilante industry for anti abortion zealots and Abortion ambulance chasers.

Cortez,
I guess we are going to agree to disagree. I don't believe that a rational discussion excludes parts of the discussion that do not favor your desired outcome. I will come back to what little detail you gave with a counter argument. I agree no mother should be forced to carry a child that was conceived by rape or incest. However the first trimester is the time to determine that. How does not a rape/incest at nine days or nine weeks become a rape/incest at 9 months?

Oh maybe an idea for a solution? in the 3rd trimester if the mother decides she doesn't want the child, she can sign a binding contract to give up the child upon birth. Her medical care is provided at no charge? Would you agree to that 3rd trimester ban on abortion?

This is how rational people can negotiate to reach solutions. But then again the crybaby Texas democrats ran away unmasked, hid and spread Covid in DC. If they had actually done their job and stayed to negotiate, maybe the law would have been different?

 

[RJWwood]

Only females care about abortion? You are truly a piece of work.

Cortez you Spanish knucklehead, women's opinions on this subject count way more than our's ...I'll say it again...this thread is a big FAIL! Go have a merlot

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez you Spanish knucklehead, women's opinions on this subject count way more than our's ...I'll say it again...this thread is a big FAIL! Go have a merlot

RJ,

You added 6 posts in this ”failed” thread. Got you hooked?

”Spanish knucklehead”? Are you now adding ethnic slurs to your list of prejudices? Also, did you see Gov Abbott’s photo op today with the Republican legislators who passed the Texas anti-abortion legislation? Bunch of white guys gloating over their regulation of women.

 

[RJWwood]

RJ,

You added 6 posts in this ”failed” thread. Got you hooked?

”Spanish knucklehead”? Are you now adding ethnic slurs to your list of prejudices? Also, did you see Gov Abbott’s photo op today with the Republican legislators who passed the Texas anti-abortion legislation? Bunch of white guys gloating over their regulation of women.

Trying to keep you alive Cortez...thread is a clunker...

 

[grbcane]

I don’t have an ideological position on your question. Rather, I defer to the judgment of the mother and her physician. I don’t think it’s any of my business.

Neither do I think that it’s the business of state government to interfere in this private decision. No exceptions for rape or incest? Absurd. Allowing private citizens to sue those who aid in abortions? Shades of “Handmaids Tale.”

Lastly, many of the Right on here argue for minimal government intervention and maximum personal freedom. I get that. This Texas law, however, represents a move to “Big
brother” government and maximum regulation of personal freedom. Why the hypocrisy?

I don’t know enough about the Texas law to endorse it, I’m sure I support most of what’s in the bill.

You don’t think it’s the state’s business to interfere with this personal decision, but you do when it comes to vaccines, both are medical decisions, that’s hypocritical.

Secondly, a baby is a separate life, it’s not an appendage of the women’s body, so we’re not talking about the women’s body at all.

Thirdly, I thought you were more woke. This isn’t a women’s issue at all, it’s a birthing person’s issue.

 

[grbcane]

 

[grbcane]

 

[cortez55403]

Trying to keep you alive Cortez...thread is a clunker...

What’s your thought on “Spanish knucklehead”? I want to understand your POV.

 

[801canesmxer]

I'd like to see no abortions one day but 6 weeks in and some would not even know they're pregnant by then and If there are no exceptions for rape or incest it should be never see the light of day. As far as this being a women's rights issue, women already have plenty of rights. They have a right to abstinence, contraception, adoption or parenthood. What we don't need and shouldn't have is the right to kill the unborn. Food for thought though, nearly 65 million babies have been aborted since Roe Vs Wade in 1973, including nearly 20 million AA babies. That's a lot of people.

 

[krvanness]

I am pro-life all the way and I'm always surprised that adoption is never brought into the debate. There are literally thousands of couples who are on list after list waiting to adopt. Many adoptions are "open" whereby the birth mother can maintain contact with the adoptive parents. If you want to "follow the science", a life begins at conception. If you don't snuff it out, it becomes a bouncing baby in 9 months. Yes, a woman has a right to her own body and heartbeat. It's that 2nd heartbeat that's the issue.

 

[cortez55403]

Although I understand the pro-life stand and have that belief in my family background as a strict Catholic, I’ve moved away from that position. Not a flame, but a couple of points:

*rich women have always had access to safe abortions. The Texas legislation (no abortions after 6 weeks) condemns poorer women unable to flee Texas to have babies they can’t care for.

*the photo op of Gov Abbott surrounded by Texas legislators who voted for the bill tells the story. It’s a photo of white men (and a smattering of white women) telling women of All colors what they can do with their bodies. Not a good look.

*the pro life concern for unborn babies sadly ends at birth. Where is the legislative passion for the care for babies born to women who can’t care for those babies? Those babies are ignored by the politicians. Not their problem.

 

[IbisRules07]

Although I understand the pro-life stand and have that belief in my family background as a strict Catholic, I’ve moved away from that position. Not a flame, but a couple of points:

*rich women have always had access to safe abortions. The Texas legislation (no abortions after 6 weeks) condemns poorer women unable to flee Texas to have babies they can’t care for.

*the photo op of Gov Abbott surrounded by Texas legislators who voted for the bill tells the story. It’s a photo of white men (and a smattering of white women) telling women of All colors what they can do with their bodies. Not a good look.

*the pro life concern for unborn babies sadly ends at birth. Where is the legislative passion for the care for babies born to women who can’t care for those babies? Those babies are ignored by the politicians. Not their problem.

Hey I know lets take the 500 million given to Planned parenthood each year and divert that to adoption and woman at risk support. FYI I have helped build woman at-risk facilities and 500 million a year would fund easlit 100 new one each year

 

[IbisRules07]

Although I understand the pro-life stand and have that belief in my family background as a strict Catholic, I’ve moved away from that position. Not a flame, but a couple of points:

*rich women have always had access to safe abortions. The Texas legislation (no abortions after 6 weeks) condemns poorer women unable to flee Texas to have babies they can’t care for.

*the photo op of Gov Abbott surrounded by Texas legislators who voted for the bill tells the story. It’s a photo of white men (and a smattering of white women) telling women of All colors what they can do with their bodies. Not a good look.

*the pro life concern for unborn babies sadly ends at birth. Where is the legislative passion for the care for babies born to women who can’t care for those babies? Those babies are ignored by the politicians. Not their problem.

Uh birth control is readily available, but the blame where it really lies

 

[RJWwood]

What’s your thought on “Spanish knucklehead”? I want to understand your POV.

Knucklehead is an ADJ...means coo coo. dumb, silly, nuts etc...Cortez is a Spanish name...so I referred to you as such...no racism, ethic slurs at all...simply addressing you in a kiddingly manner...don't take it wrong you California Smoothie ha ha ha hope your wine last night hit the spot.

Oh and BTW I have Spanish blood in me...I've called myself a "Spanish Knucklehead" many times...my wife too...

 

[cortez55403]

Knucklehead is an ADJ...means coo coo. dumb, silly, nuts etc...Cortez is a Spanish name...so I referred to you as such...no racism, ethic slurs at all...simply addressing you in a kiddingly manner...don't take it wrong you California Smoothie ha ha ha hope your wine last night hit the spot.

Oh and BTW I have Spanish blood in me...I've called myself a "Spanish Knucklehead" many times...my wife too...

Thanks for the explanation. Reference to my presumed ethnicity has popped up several times on this site. Ironically, I’m 100% Irish as documented by 23 and Me.

Those who have been members on here for many years might recall that my screen name as “Cortez” is my tribute to a favorite Cane, Cortez Kennedy. Based on his name, you might think he was Spanish/Irish. Don’t think he was either.

Cortez was that rare DT who could stuff the run and rush the passer from the inside. Could our young 5 star DT be the next Cortez? 🙏

 

[RJWwood]

Thanks for the explanation. Reference to my presumed ethnicity has popped up several times on this site. Ironically, I’m 100% Irish as documented by 23 and Me.

Those who have been members on here for many years might recall that my screen name as “Cortez” is my tribute to a favorite Cane, Cortez Kennedy. Based on his name, you might think he was Spanish/Irish. Don’t think he was either.

Cortez was that rare DT who could stuff the run and rush the passer from the inside. Could our young 5 star DT be the next Cortez? 🙏

I too have Irish blood on my mothers side...love the Irish heritage.
Can surely use another CK...and real fast!

have a great day Cortez...and let's hope for a WIN tomorrow

 

[krvanness]

Although I understand the pro-life stand and have that belief in my family background as a strict Catholic, I’ve moved away from that position. Not a flame, but a couple of points:

*rich women have always had access to safe abortions. The Texas legislation (no abortions after 6 weeks) condemns poorer women unable to flee Texas to have babies they can’t care for.

*the photo op of Gov Abbott surrounded by Texas legislators who voted for the bill tells the story. It’s a photo of white men (and a smattering of white women) telling women of All colors what they can do with their bodies. Not a good look.

*the pro life concern for unborn babies sadly ends at birth. Where is the legislative passion for the care for babies born to women who can’t care for those babies? Those babies are ignored by the politicians. Not their problem.

How about the adoption option in lieu of abortion? Since you said you're Catholic, here's a site that can help:

Adopting? How to adopt or foster a child, baby or orphan | Adoption.com

Adopting a child, adopt US & international kids, adoption agencies, photolisting, unplanned pregnancy, forums, registry, records, fostering, foster care, open, domestic, private, embryo, transracial, process and costs

adoption.com

 

[central17]

Although I understand the pro-life stand and have that belief in my family background as a strict Catholic, I’ve moved away from that position. Not a flame, but a couple of points:

*rich women have always had access to safe abortions. The Texas legislation (no abortions after 6 weeks) condemns poorer women unable to flee Texas to have babies they can’t care for.

*the photo op of Gov Abbott surrounded by Texas legislators who voted for the bill tells the story. It’s a photo of white men (and a smattering of white women) telling women of All colors what they can do with their bodies. Not a good look.

*the pro life concern for unborn babies sadly ends at birth. Where is the legislative passion for the care for babies born to women who can’t care for those babies? Those babies are ignored by the politicians. Not their problem.

Cortez,
You will say and do anything to avoid talking about the elephant in the room - 2nd and 3rd Trimester abortions. You have posted multiple times, trying everything to deflect, aka, old white men pictures, yes a bad look but so is a 9 month old dead fetus with a doctor provided .punctured skull. If you want to bring a rational debate to this board, then the 2nd and 3rd month must be part of the discussion. Right now your argument is a lame set of slogans and fear mongering.

 

[honeyiv]

To show the lunacy of a Repub controlled state like Texas!

Lol. Because they don't want to let illegal Mexicans vote?

 

[miamimike]

Lol. Because they don't want to let illegal Mexicans vote?

Because they already lead the nation in gun deaths and now they want zero restrictions. Lock and load amigo!

 

[cortez55403]

Cortez,
You will say and do anything to avoid talking about the elephant in the room - 2nd and 3rd Trimester abortions. You have posted multiple times, trying everything to deflect, aka, old white men pictures, yes a bad look but so is a 9 month old dead fetus with a doctor provided .punctured skull. If you want to bring a rational debate to this board, then the 2nd and 3rd month must be part of the discussion. Right now your argument is a lame set of slogans and fear mongering.

17,

As you said, we’ll have to agree to disagree. When you bounced the discussion to the second and third trimesters, I responded in detail. Your image of a doctor puncturing skulls = fear mongering at its best.

2nd and 3rd trimester decisions are truly difficult. What is clear to me, however, is that I don’t want state legislators making those medical decisions. They are politically driven rather than guided by the health of the mother and the fetus/baby pre and post delivery.