Bolton's Draft Manuscript Leaked

[Cane Attack]

Surprised there's no chatter or thread on this new info released last nite. If true, and it apparently is, don't you think it adds weight to getting witnesses to testify?

Let em testify, so we can get to the bottom of this. He's guilty as all hell, a mountain of evidence already, but not enough to convince most of his supporters.

He obstructed Congress. He refused to cooperate at all, 100% refusal to abide by the request of a co-equal branch of government. If you want a monarch, then I guess co-equal has no meaning. If you agree with the constitution, then you have no choice but to agree that he obstructed.

He abused his power, tried to bribe a foreign government (by withholding foreign aid, $391M) to provide statements/dirt on a political opponent for his own personal gain in the upcoming 2020 presidential election. That was a quid pro quo. He didn't do that for the peoples of America. He did it for himself. And how many Ukrainians died as a result of Trump ordering foreign aid withheld? That fking blood is on his hands folks.

We can not have presidents using foreign governments to affect our elections. How can anyone not agree to that?

 

[289fia]

Surprised there's no chatter or thread on this new info released last nite. If true, and it apparently is, don't you think it adds weight to getting witnesses to testify?

Let em testify, so we can get to the bottom of this. He's guilty as all hell, a mountain of evidence already, but not enough to convince most of his supporters.

He obstructed Congress. He refused to cooperate at all, 100% refusal to abide by the request of a co-equal branch of government. If you want a monarch, then I guess co-equal has no meaning. If you agree with the constitution, then you have no choice but to agree that he obstructed.

He abused his power, tried to bribe a foreign government (by withholding foreign aid, $391M) to provide statements/dirt on a political opponent for his own personal gain in the upcoming 2020 presidential election. That was a quid pro quo. He didn't do that for the peoples of America. He did it for himself. And how many Ukrainians died as a result of Trump ordering foreign aid withheld? That fking blood is on his hands folks.

We can not have presidents using foreign governments to affect our elections. How can anyone not agree to that?

Didn't Bill and Barak do that? Both of them. Multiple times.

 

[ZEKEMUG]

Surprised there's no chatter or thread on this new info released last nite. If true, and it apparently is, don't you think it adds weight to getting witnesses to testify?

Let em testify, so we can get to the bottom of this. He's guilty as all hell, a mountain of evidence already, but not enough to convince most of his supporters.

He obstructed Congress. He refused to cooperate at all, 100% refusal to abide by the request of a co-equal branch of government. If you want a monarch, then I guess co-equal has no meaning. If you agree with the constitution, then you have no choice but to agree that he obstructed.

He abused his power, tried to bribe a foreign government (by withholding foreign aid, $391M) to provide statements/dirt on a political opponent for his own personal gain in the upcoming 2020 presidential election. That was a quid pro quo. He didn't do that for the peoples of America. He did it for himself. And how many Ukrainians died as a result of Trump ordering foreign aid withheld? That fking blood is on his hands folks.

We can not have presidents using foreign governments to affect our elections. How can anyone not agree to that?

key words second sentence “ if true “. Next question , if you’re a co-equal branch of government which executive branch is. Why does President have to do what congress says ? There’s a third branch that CONGRESS choose not to use.

 

[lima23]

When Putin invaded Eastern Ukraine and also took the Crimea, Obama refused to send arms. Even after Putin's forces in Eastern Ukraine shot down a plane with Westerners on it, Obama refused to send military aid. No one died in Ukraine as a result of Trump's temporary suspension of military aid.

 

[bobbie jo]

Surprised there's no chatter or thread on this new info released last nite. If true, and it apparently is, don't you think it adds weight to getting witnesses to testify?

Let em testify, so we can get to the bottom of this. He's guilty as all hell, a mountain of evidence already, but not enough to convince most of his supporters.

He obstructed Congress. He refused to cooperate at all, 100% refusal to abide by the request of a co-equal branch of government. If you want a monarch, then I guess co-equal has no meaning. If you agree with the constitution, then you have no choice but to agree that he obstructed.

He abused his power, tried to bribe a foreign government (by withholding foreign aid, $391M) to provide statements/dirt on a political opponent for his own personal gain in the upcoming 2020 presidential election. That was a quid pro quo. He didn't do that for the peoples of America. He did it for himself. And how many Ukrainians died as a result of Trump ordering foreign aid withheld? That fking blood is on his hands folks.

We can not have presidents using foreign governments to affect our elections. How can anyone not agree to that?

So what about Biden and Obama. Each caught on live tape doing it. Last time I checked the President has the right to ask about corruption even if it means a American being involved. Trump did that the other two got caught on tape being the corrupt ones with a foreign country.

 

[lima23]

Good summary of the ongoing combat since 2014 between the Russian soldiers masquerading as Ukrainians and the actual Ukrainians. Note the American weapons given to the Ukrainians are still in warehouses. No Russian tanks to date have invaded Ukraine so American Javelins are not called for. What we have since 2014 is intense trench warfare reminiscent of WWI or the last year of the Civil War (Grant vs. Lee after the battle of the Wilderness). People are dying RIGHT NOW and they will continue to die no matter how much aid we send. https://www.dailysignal.com/2019/11...t-on-the-value-of-us-military-aid-to-ukraine/

 

[lou97]

key words second sentence “ if true “. Next question , if you’re a co-equal branch of government which executive branch is. Why does President have to do what congress says ? There’s a third branch that CONGRESS choose not to use.

Well there's one way for everyone to determine for themselves if it's true? Wanna give a guess what that is? And Congress has subpoena power. Yes they are equal branches of government but that doesn't mean both branches have the exact same powers. Seems like you're grasping at straws here trying to defend not having him testify. If your dear leader did nothing wrong what are you worried about?

 

[hawkcanes]

Nobody died because the aid was withheld. The aid that was due was for the following years budget. It had no immediate impact

 

[lima23]

Well there's one way for everyone to determine for themselves if it's true? Wanna give a guess what that is? And Congress has subpoena power. Yes they are equal branches of government but that doesn't mean both branches have the exact same powers. Seems like you're grasping at straws here trying to defend not having him testify. If your dear leader did nothing wrong what are you worried about?

Sure, they have subpoena power. And if the Executive branch resists a subpoena the Congress takes it to the courts. Happens every day in litigation. They didn't do it.

 

[lima23]

Hearings to be held by the courts were fast tracked. But the Democrats were in a rush. https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...06e5bc-ff3e-11e9-8bab-0fc209e065a8_story.html

 

[jpboca]

 

[lou97]

Sure, they have subpoena power. And if the Executive branch resists a subpoena the Congress takes it to the courts. Happens every day in litigation. They didn't do it.

Well the house didn't subpoena Bolton. They asked him to testify and he didn't. They chose not to subpoena him and then go through a year or more long court process. But if the Senate votes for it they will subpoena him and Trump will challenge in the courts and lose. So when that happens the Trumpers will be onto the next argument against Bolton testifying. It's funny to watch the Trumpers do nothing but attack the process versus arguing the facts. But of course it's difficult to do when facts aren't on their side.

 

[lou97]

Nobody died because the aid was withheld. The aid that was due was for the following years budget. It had no immediate impact

Irrelevant to what he is charged with. Nobody died when Clinton committed perjury either.

 

[cdwright40]

Been very busy this morning. But yeah I saw this.... And all these leaks are killing Trumps public perception. Especially among independents.

 

[lima23]

Irrelevant to what he is charged with. Nobody died when Clinton committed perjury either.

Reread what your fellow Democrat started this string with. I know it was a ridiculous point, but this is the argument the guy who started this string made, as well as the argument the house managers made.

 

[lima23]

Well the house didn't subpoena Bolton. They asked him to testify and he didn't. They chose not to subpoena him and then go through a year or more long court process. But if the Senate votes for it they will subpoena him and Trump will challenge in the courts and lose. So when that happens the Trumpers will be onto the next argument against Bolton testifying. It's funny to watch the Trumpers do nothing but attack the process versus arguing the facts. But of course it's difficult to do when facts aren't on their side.
Last I checked the President's team are arguing facts and process.

 

[lima23]

And of course you are going to argue process when there was no process. Likewise they refuted the facts, even though the Democrats had no facts to support their position... just opinions... and nothing more.

 

[cdwright40]

I am laughing my ass off at all these bullshit talking points on the right. This is how you know someone is guilty AF! You cats sound like Johnny Cochran explaining where OJ was the night of the murders....lol. Stop!

Look...I am not an attorney....nor are most of you. I only care about guilty or innocent. PERIOD! I don't care about legalese. That is moot

I am not interested in getting some one guilty off.... I care about if laws were broken. Plain and simple.

 

[lima23]

I am laughing my ass off at all these bullshit talking points on the right. This is how you know someone is guilty AF! You cats sound like Johnny Cochran explaining where OJ was the night of the murders....lol. Stop!

Look...I am not an attorney....nor are most of you. I only care about guilty or innocent. PERIOD! I don't care about legalese. That is moot

I am not interested in getting some one guilty off.... I care about if laws were broken. Plain and simple.

Name the law you contend was broken.

 

[Cane Attack]

Nobody died because the aid was withheld. The aid that was due was for the following years budget. It had no immediate impact

Wrong hawk. C'mon man, surely you knew that. Had the aid not been used by the end of the FY, then it was gone.

The $391M in Ukrainian Aid was budgeted for FY19, which runs from Oct 1st of 2018 until Sep 30 of 2019.

Yes people did die as a result of the lag in the release of the aid. There's a war between Ukraine and Russia and, for example, a key weapons system purchase, the Javelin, was delayed. How many died because of the holdup in aid? Who knows? But it's common sense that if you hold up bullets, Soldiers/people are gonna die as a result.

 

[cdwright40]

Name the law you contend was broken.

Here are a couple:

Extortion by officers or employees of the United States.

Obstruction of Congress

 

[Cane Attack]

Been very busy this morning. But yeah I saw this.... And all these leaks are killing Trumps public perception. Especially among independents.

It's so damn funny that people actually buy into the president, the republicans, the president's lawyers. They all have egg all over their face and the sheep that believe them actually look fkin ignorant. I don't like to disparage the pro-Trump CS members by name-calling, but damn this is so plain as day. Seemingly every day another shoe drops and his supporters look foolish.

Trump will likely beat this rap. Get acquitted. And I'm gonna move on from there and hope the American people see him for what he truly is and vote him history in 2020.

I have no problem living under a conservative president. May not agree with every policy, but as long as the candidate has some fking integrity then I can live with that. But this joker has corrupted the government. People are trying to fight back, but when he's got a scared Senate, and top political appointees in government, in his corner, there's not much we can do until he's voted gone. Even then, he may refuse to accept election results. That right there is scary.

 

[cdwright40]

It's so damn funny that people actually buy into the president, the republicans, the president's lawyers. They all have egg all over their face and the sheep that believe them actually look fkin ignorant. I don't like to disparage the pro-Trump CS members by name-calling, but damn this is so plain as day. Seemingly every day another shoe drops and his supporters look foolish.

Trump will likely beat this rap. Get acquitted. And I'm gonna move on from there and hope the American people see him for what he truly is and vote him history in 2020.

I have no problem living under a conservative president. May not agree with every policy, by as long as the candidate has some fking integrity then I can live with that. But this joker has corrupted the government. People are trying to fight back, but when he's got a scared Senate, and top political appointees in government, in his corner, there's not much we can do until he's voted gone. Even then, he may refuse to accept election results. That right there is scary.

Same here....I am not obsessed with party at all. The sad thing is people define themselves by money. Integrity only matters for every one else. Never them.... because it's what about him or her. Never self accountability.

 

[lima23]

Here are a couple:

Extortion by officers or employees of the United States.

Obstruction of Congress

You obviously don't know the elements of extortion. Apparently your Democratic congressmen do because they didn't put extortion into their articles. As for obstruction of congress, anyone, including the President, has the right and ability to challenge a subpoena in a court of competent jurisdiction.

 

[lima23]

Wrong hawk. C'mon man, surely you knew that. Had the aid not been used by the end of the FY, then it was gone.

The $391M in Ukrainian Aid was budgeted for FY19, which runs from Oct 1st of 2018 until Sep 30 of 2019.

Yes people did die as a result of the lag in the release of the aid. There's a war between Ukraine and Russia and, for example, a key weapons system purchase, the Javelin, was delayed. How many died because of the holdup in aid? Who knows? But it's common sense that if you hold up bullets, Soldiers/people are gonna die as a result.

Bullets were not at issue. Read the article I posted. Here is another one. 13 thousand Ukrainians have died. Most of them during Obama's administration. https://www.rferl.org/a/death-toll-...-conflict-says-un-rights-office/29791647.html

 

[lima23]

The only time that I know when bullets were cut off was during Vietnam when the Democrats cut off bullets to the South Vietnamese to make sure that the NVA won.

 

[cdwright40]

You obviously don't know the elements of extortion. Apparently your Democratic congressmen do because they didn't put extortion into their articles. As for obstruction of congress, anyone, including the President, has the right and ability to challenge a subpoena in a court of competent jurisdiction.

The actual main crime is not in the two articles that are public. You asked for the crime....and I provided two here....we have a trial ongoing... I realize you are being facetious asking this question.... but don't ask if you don't agree with the answer. Let the trial play out.....and the proper people make the decisions they are supposed to make. What he is alleged to have done is what I mentioned... That is the answer to your question.

 

[GLFSTRM]

Patrick Philbin is giving a free law class as we speak, tune in and learn libs. All your questions will be answered.

 

[lima23]

The actual main crime is not in the two articles that are public. You asked for the crime....and I provided two here....we have a trial ongoing... I realize you are being facetious asking this question.... but don't ask if you don't agree with the answer. Let the trial play out.....and the proper people make the decisions they are supposed to make. What he is alleged to have done is what I mentioned... That is the answer to your question.[/QUOTI
I was not being facetious. I was asking you what law he broke. You failed to answer. That's not on me; it's on you.

 

[lima23]

Patrick Philbin is giving a free law class as we speak, tune in and learn libs. All your questions will be answered.

Philbin is a lawyer's lawyer. He is too cerebral for those Democrats who post here.

 

[e_cushing]

Obstruction of Congress.................................
HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHHA

wait wait

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHAHAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAAA

 

[cdwright40]

Yes you were. Because it is facetious to even believe we would impeach a president without a governing body believing there weren't high crimes and misdemeanors.

Stop believing self serving bullshit. The House impeached him.... they are the governing body.

 

[lima23]

Yes you were. Because it is facetious to even believe we would impeach a president without a governing body believing there weren't high crimes and misdemeanors.

Stop believing self serving bullshit. The House impeached him.... they are the governing body.

First, unlike Nixon and Clinton, not one member of the opposite party voted for impeachment. That goes directly to the credibility of the Articles. Second, they hastily impeached because they knew that actual testimony of Republican and Democratic positions would expose the flaws in their articles. Third, Congress is not the governing body. You need to review your high school civics' books. I assume you meant Congress was the entity who had the sole power to impeach, but you did not say that. As far as governing goes, the House has the power to pass a law and if the Senate concurs in its passage and the President signs then it becomes law, UNLESS THE COURTS DECLARE IT UNCONSTITUTIONAL (Read Marbury v. Madison) (you and your fellow authoritarian Democrats are imbuing Congress with the powers the Legislative Assembly had during the French Revolution) Back to America, after the foregoing process as set forth in the Constitution the President, not the Congress, would administer those laws, i.e. governs.

 

[ZEKEMUG]

Well there's one way for everyone to determine for themselves if it's true? Wanna give a guess what that is? And Congress has subpoena power. Yes they are equal branches of government but that doesn't mean both branches have the exact same powers. Seems like you're grasping at straws here trying to defend not having him testify. If your dear leader did nothing wrong what are you worried about?

So at what point does congress have to follow the law. Goofy Nadler called Executive Privilege nonsense. I guess you think this Bolton leak is just coincidence ? Let’s see NY Times were they right on Russia ? Stormy ? Avenotti etc. Why didn’t the manager bring the deposition that was exculpatory for Trump. It’s rigged and it’s obvious.

 

[lou97]

So at what point does congress have to follow the law. Goofy Nadler called Executive Privilege nonsense. I guess you think this Bolton leak is just coincidence ? Let’s see NY Times were they right on Russia ? Stormy ? Avenotti etc. Why didn’t the manager bring the deposition that was exculpatory for Trump. It’s rigged and it’s obvious.

What law didn't they follow? And executive privilege is nonsense in this case. Bolton wrote a book that covers this topic and will be available to entire world in March. What privileged information is he trying to protect if that information will be published in a matter of weeks? Again why are you afraid of Bolton testifying if your dear leader did nothing wrong? Everything was perfect wasn't it? If it was, why not bring him in to say so?

 

[Cane Attack]

What law didn't they follow? And executive privilege is nonsense in this case. Bolton wrote a book that covers this topic and will be available to entire world in March. What privileged information is he trying to protect if that information will be published in a matter of weeks? Again why are you afraid of Bolton testifying if your dear leader did nothing wrong? Everything was perfect wasn't it? If it was, why not bring him in to say so?

Because their worship of Trump clouds their judgement.

 

[lima23]

I have no doubt that Trump wanted Biden to be investigated...as well he should be. But at this point the Articles should be weighed on their merits... which are none. Most civil cases are dismissed, either by a motion to dismiss or by a summary judgment... and this especially true if either the law or the facts are not sufficient to carry the day. This monstrosity needs to be dismissed.

 

[lima23]

Because their worship of Trump clouds their judgement.

I, for one, don't worship Trump. But I don't want crazed authoritarians, which the Democrats surely are, taking over the United States.

 

[ZEKEMUG]

What law didn't they follow? And executive privilege is nonsense in this case. Bolton wrote a book that covers this topic and will be available to entire world in March. What privileged information is he trying to protect if that information will be published in a matter of weeks? Again why are you afraid of Bolton testifying if your dear leader did nothing wrong? Everything was perfect wasn't it? If it was, why not bring him in to say so?

Fine bring the Whistleblower, Schiff the whole gang. As for law why wasn’t the President granted due process in the house ? When did you decide President should be impeached please include all past try’s you supported.

 

[lou97]

Fine bring the Whistleblower, Schiff the whole gang. As for law why wasn’t the President granted due process in the house ? When did you decide President should be impeached please include all past try’s you supported.

I don't mind having other witnesses. Both sides should be entitled to witnesses. But I'll let you in on a little secret. The last thing your boy wants is for Bolton to testify. Why you ask? Because he knows where the bodies are buried. And I'm not just talking about the Ukraine issue. By the way, I noticed you didn't answer my question. What law did Congress break?

As far as your question, are you asking me personally when I came to the conclusion that he should be impeached?