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2 republican Governors endorse bill to ban

CashvilleCane1

CashvilleCane1

SuperCane
Jan 6, 2011
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Chokeholds by law enforcement. Here’s some breaking news, chokeholds are already illegal and have been for as long as I’ve been around unless it’s deadly force meeting deadly force.

if you are trying to kill a cop by shooting them and I drop a wrecking ball on you is that excessive force? If you have a knife and are trying to stab an officer and I choke you out and you die is that excessive force?

See where this is going! Dog and pony show for ignorant people who don’t know any better.
 
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CashvilleCane1 said:
Chokeholds by law enforcement. Here’s some breaking news, chokeholds are already illegally and have been for as long as I’ve been around unless it’s deadly force meeting deadly force.

if you are trying to kill a cop by shooting them and I drop a wrecking ball on you is that excessive force? If you have a knife and are trying to stab an officer and I choke you out and you die is that excessive force?

See where this is going! Dog and pony show for ignorant people who don’t know any better.
Click to expand...
CD will set you straight Cash...
 
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CashvilleCane1 said:
Chokeholds by law enforcement. Here’s some breaking news, chokeholds are already illegally and have been for as long as I’ve been around unless it’s deadly force meeting deadly force.

if you are trying to kill a cop by shooting them and I drop a wrecking ball on you is that excessive force? If you have a knife and are trying to stab an officer and I choke you out and you die is that excessive force?

See where this is going! Dog and pony show for ignorant people who don’t know any better.
Click to expand...

chokeholds were not banned nationally. Only in certain locales. Progress. Thank you to those governors!
 
Body cameras that cant be disabled will fix all this bullshit. Add a independent review panel for all leo interactions and hold cops accountable like citizens are.And not allowing a officer to abuse someone in one job, get fired and rehired somewhere else. Too many people are sitting in prison or dead due to bad cops.
 
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CashvilleCane1 said:
Which states allowed chokeholds & under what circumstances?
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In Colorado for example...denver and aurora used to allow chokeholds when a suspect is Simply resisting and not nec a threat. But now they ban them for resisting And in all situation.

in Colorado some dept allow chokeholds in all situations
 
deuce1906 said:
In Colorado for example...denver and aurora used to allow chokeholds when a suspect is Simply resisting and not nec a threat. But now they ban them for resisting And in all situation.

in Colorado some dept allow chokeholds in all situations
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Not sure where you heard that but it’s false. I think I know what you’re thinking now. Chokeholds are cutting off the airway. A vascular neck restraint (VNR) cuts blood flow to the brain through the artery. VNR is not illegal but we only use it when absolutely necessary because it looks like you’re choking someone out. Pressure is applied to sides of the neck not the front. It’s not a choke though.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.denverpost.com/2020/06/10/colorado-police-chokehold-policies/amp/

took me 15 seconds to find it.
 
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gamecane1979 said:
Body cameras that cant be disabled will fix all this bullshit. Add a independent review panel for all leo interactions and hold cops accountable like citizens are.And not allowing a officer to abuse someone in one job, get fired and rehired somewhere else. Too many people are sitting in prison or dead due to bad cops.
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It sounds logical to make body cameras that can’t be disabled, but I was talking to a homicide detective, he told me that the camera got in the way of him solving cases. Whenever he’d arrive at a crime scene he could ask witnesses if they knew anything, once he had the camera no one wanted to talk.
 
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grbcane said:
It sounds logical to make body cameras that can’t be disabled, but I was talking to a homicide detective, he told me that the camera got in the way of him solving cases. Whenever he’d arrive at a crime scene he could ask witnesses if they knew anything, once he had the camera no one wanted to talk.
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That's one detective. There are thousands of innocent men and women in prison from cops lies. It will do more good than bad. And that detective is lazy. It would mean him doing a better job as they should already do.
 
CashvilleCane1 said:
Not sure where you heard that but it’s false. I think I know what you’re thinking now. Chokeholds are cutting off the airway. A vascular neck restraint (VNR) cuts blood flow to the brain through the artery. VNR is not illegal but we only use it when absolutely necessary because it looks like you’re choking someone out. Pressure is applied to sides of the neck not the front. It’s not a choke though.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.denverpost.com/2020/06/10/colorado-police-chokehold-policies/amp/

took me 15 seconds to find it.
Click to expand...

same article. You must read diff. I get the diff between a carotid and resp chockehold. Glad we are on the same article. So we got our news even, we just need to break down comprehension. Let’s talk my fellow cane!

what are you getting out of this article?
 
gamecane1979 said:
That's one detective. There are thousands of innocent men and women in prison from cops lies. It will do more good than bad. And that detective is lazy. It would mean him doing a better job as they should already do.
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When you arrive at a fresh crime scene ripe with witnesses, I would think time is of the essence, that’s when people are ready to talk. I would bet that’s how most crimes are solved, most people in a neighborhood where a murder takes place want it to be solved, but they don’t want people to know they helped.
 
deuce1906 said:
same article. You must read diff. I get the diff between a carotid and resp chockehold. Glad we are on the same article. So we got our news even, we just need to break down comprehension. Let’s talk my fellow cane!

what are you getting out of this article?
Click to expand...
I used to teach academy recruits as a part time academy defensive tactics instructor. I taught 50+ recruits every Friday for 10 weeks. I have actually taught VNR. Next time I’m down for a game I will explain it and show you the difference. I’ll allow you to try both on me so you can see the difference. They’re nothing alike.
 
CashvilleCane1 said:
I used to teach academy recruits as a part time academy defensive tactics instructor. I taught 50+ recruits every Friday for 10 weeks. I have actually taught VNR. Next time I’m down for a game I will explain it and show you the difference. I’ll allow you to try both on me so you can see the difference. They’re nothing alike.
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Both should Outlawed bc both are dangerous and can kill...
 
deuce1906 said:
Both should Outlawed bc both are dangerous and can kill...
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VNR causes unconsciousness but once you’re out and the restraint is removed you come right back. If applied incorrectly then it’s a choke which would be illegal anyway. The only way you kill someone with VNR is to hold it well past unconsciousness until they’re dead.
 
Here’s the issue with that, you can cause irreversible brain damage blocking the carotid. Especially if there’s something in that persons medical history that can cause it to be fatal. And in the heat of the moment, your not having the person fill out a medical history form....
 
deuce1906 said:
Here’s the issue with that, you can cause irreversible brain damage blocking the carotid. Especially if there’s something in that persons medical history that can cause it to be fatal. And in the heat of the moment, your not having the person fill out a medical history form....
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Which is why once unconsciousness is reaches you let go. You’ll have enough time to secure them before they’re back to reality. If it were so dangerous UFC wouldn’t allow it. Being properly trained though is a key.
 
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CashvilleCane1 said:
Which is why once unconsciousness is reaches you let go. You’ll have enough time to secure them before they’re back to reality. If it were so dangerous UFC wouldn’t allow it. Being properly trained though is a key.
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well to be honest I don’t count on proper training in the heat of the moment. And UFC also allows it bc they know everything about a fighters med history. If he or she wasn’t healthy they wouldn’t be in the octagon. And these people are usually in tip top shape. Not someone who is overweight, heart issues, POSs under the influence of a legal or illegal substance.....
 
deuce1906 said:
well to be honest I don’t count on proper training in the heat of the moment. And UFC also allows it bc they know everything about a fighters med history. If he or she wasn’t healthy they wouldn’t be in the octagon. And these people are usually in tip top shape. Not someone who is overweight, heart issues, POSs under the influence of a legal or illegal substance.....
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Valid points
 
Why not increase the penalty for resisting arrest also. All these solutions put the answer just on the police. Make it a more serious offense with real consequences and maybe it will cut down on escalation of incidents.
 
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deuce1906 said:
Here’s the issue with that, you can cause irreversible brain damage blocking the carotid. Especially if there’s something in that persons medical history that can cause it to be fatal. And in the heat of the moment, your not having the person fill out a medical history form....
Click to expand...
Sounds like resisting arrest is a bigger cause of death.
 
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ZEKEMUG said:
Why not increase the penalty for resisting arrest also. All these solutions put the answer just on the police. Make it a more serious offense with real consequences and maybe it will cut down on escalation of incidents.
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Agree. Double the sentence. If innocent, 2x0=0
 
ZEKEMUG said:
Why not increase the penalty for resisting arrest also. All these solutions put the answer just on the police. Make it a more serious offense with real consequences and maybe it will cut down on escalation of incidents.
Click to expand...

i don’t think more people in jail is the solution. We already have an issue with over population of prison. The crime bill in 1994 increased the penalty for a ton of things all we got out of it is more people in jail for longer ruining people’s lives and their families. Prison reform was passed a couple years ago to undue a lot of nonviolent crimes sentences.

we’ve always put the responsibility on the suspect, never truly asked police to change their approach. That’s why we incarcerate more people than any other country in the world per capita and that hasn’t been a deterrent. Difference is they police a bit different than us. Crime rate has dramatically decreased since 1990, we are less violent as a society overall. Time to adapt the way policing is done.
 
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deuce1906 said:
i don’t think more people in jail is the solution. We already have an issue with over population of prison. The crime bill in 1994 increased the penalty for a ton of things all we got out of it is more people in jail for longer ruining people’s lives and their families. Prison reform was passed a couple years ago to undue a lot of nonviolent crimes sentences.

we’ve always put the responsibility on the suspect, never truly asked police to change their approach.
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This was a violent crime on police once he resisted and stole a weapon from an officer.

Much, but not all, of the responsibility is on the suspect committing the crime.
If everyone followed the rules, there is no crime, and there would be no criminals and little need for police.
This is not reality.

Facts below...

Police are always changing their approaches. Police are managed at the local levels.
Changes rely on funding.
Defunding police counters the necessary resources required for additional changes.

All of this focus on police is just a distraction from addressing the real issues within the black community. What do you propose to change there?
 
gamecane1979 said:
That's one detective. There are thousands of innocent men and women in prison from cops lies. It will do more good than bad. And that detective is lazy. It would mean him doing a better job as they should already do.
Click to expand...
So defund the police nationwide but ensure that everyone in the force has a mandated expensive sophisticated piece of equipment. Got it. Dem logic at it’s finest. Maybe replace all their real guns with paintball guns and their night sticks with wiffle bats while their at it too.
 
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6882 said:
So defund the police nationwide but ensure that everyone in the force has a mandated expensive sophisticated piece of equipment. Got it. Dem logic at it’s finest. Maybe replace all their real guns with paintball guns and their night sticks with wiffle bats while their at it too.
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Loony logic!
 
Cash, I have a buddy who is friends with Chief Rolle ( Antrell dad) in Homestead and he says their policy is this:
If you give orders and they aren’t complied with immediately use your pepper spray.
Why isn’t this standard procedure every where? As soon as a cops orders are ignored things can get out of control quickly.
Just seems the easiest way to get a suspect under control without seriously hurting him.
 
4210 said:
Cash, I have a buddy who is friends with Chief Rolle ( Antrell dad) in Homestead and he says their policy is this:
If you give orders and they aren’t complied with immediately use your pepper spray.
Why isn’t this standard procedure every where? As soon as a cops orders are ignored things can get out of control quickly.
Just seems the easiest way to get a suspect under control without seriously hurting him.
Click to expand...
In this era many would consider it escalating a situation too quickly
 
4210 said:
Cash, I have a buddy who is friends with Chief Rolle ( Antrell dad) in Homestead and he says their policy is this:
If you give orders and they aren’t complied with immediately use your pepper spray.
Why isn’t this standard procedure every where? As soon as a cops orders are ignored things can get out of control quickly.
Just seems the easiest way to get a suspect under control without seriously hurting him.
Click to expand...
I’ve known Chief Rolle for many many years - can’t find a better person
 
ZEKEMUG said:
Why not increase the penalty for resisting arrest also. All these solutions put the answer just on the police. Make it a more serious offense with real consequences and maybe it will cut down on escalation of incidents.
Click to expand...
FL has a resisting without violence charge which is a misdemeanor and then a resisting with violence which is a felony.
 
MutinousCane said:
In this era many would consider it escalating a situation too quickly
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I guess so but once someone ignores you as a cop it seems like a very clear indication that shit may hit the fan quickly......
What are their choices after that? Seems like you only have three; pull your gun, pepper spray or try to physically get him to comply which is when all the problems start.
 
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Cash please weigh in on my question and subsequent post - will be curious to get your take
 
4210 said:
Cash please weigh in on my question and subsequent post - will be curious to get your take
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People in general are fairly easy to read with the exception of drunks and the Atlanta deal was textbook with what I’m talking about.

I’ve always used the line from the movie Roadhouse, “be nice until it’s time not to be nice anymore”. 9/10 people have a hard time being rude to you when you’re being nice to them. Sometimes though they’re just stupid ignorant ass people though and you have to affect the necessary force to make the arrest.

I equate it to we are a customer service based organization and we give the customer what they’re asking for. Let them make the decision as what service they’re given. I do not encourage attitude because it’s not necessary plus it makes us look like an antagonis!
 
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