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Most Of You Are Right, And I Am Wrong.

A beer commercial did away with your convictions? You're OK with letting in people from known terrorist havens without proper vetting because of a beer commercial? LOL

I guess you @canesrule21'ships @Azar @cems52 @GILL06 and @cdwright40 will be out protesting now....
Dr.L.ThugU,
You know just as well as I do that 15 of the 19 9/11 hijackers were from the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. I've got another question for you and Advarkas and not to try to start any sh** but what are your thoughts on Trump's latest comments defending Vladimir Putin again?
 
Boom!... Great post Gru... Hopefully, all of the minions will now understand...;)


Don't understand. Trying to though. So help me out. 2+ years of vetting and wait by refugees is currently happening. That's not arguable, it's happening. So what exactly is going to happen in 90 days, to somehow change things for the better? That's my first question. Does the system as is now in place have some weaknesses? I'm sure it must. But no "system," is going to be fail proof. What's going on here is Mr.Trump wanting to fulfill a campaign promise. A hot button topic that got his root supporters jacked up. A statement he himself made and is recorded for the World to see. He called for a Muslim ban. Period. We can try and crest our own "alternative facts." But truth is always truth. Do we need to better the system? I guess so. Do we need to blow up what the Statue of Liberty stands for and represents? No. There is no need for any ban, Muslim or otherwise. This isn't an emergency, no new intelligence intel has come through saying we need to do this because terror is eminent. We need to get a grip. And not just accept stuff because it is coming out of the West Wing. Or dismiss it either because it comes from the west wing. Need to be rational here.
 
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Dr.L.ThugU,
You know just as well as I do that 15 of the 19 9/11 hijackers were from the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. I've got another question for you and Advarkas and not to try to start any sh** but what are your thoughts on Trump's latest comments defending Vladimir Putin again?
This argument is irrelevant.

Given the fact that those hijackers were from that country, the vetting process has evolved in the last 15+ years since for them, a forcing function if you will. The process for those other countries has been deemed insufficient, today.

While implementation of the order could have been better for those people already approved and vetted by the US, I am not sure what is difficult to understand about the current policy?
 
That Super Bowl Commercial just now- the Budweiser one, that features Adolphus Busch coming from Deutschland.

It broght tears to my eyes. I cried when I saw it, amd I'm not afraid to say it. I've been thinking about it and I admit that the Democrats are right. We Republicans are wrong. Trump is wrong for that Executive Order.

Thank you.

The Courts are right.

Prost! (Cheers!)
You're a good man
 
A few things....
1. You're right, the visa process is extensive but there is nothing wrong with making it more effective in identifying possible terrorists. The ban, which is a temporary 90 day ban, is intended to take a timeout and revevaluate the process. I don't see the problem in allowing our vetting process to be evaluated and improved upon and putting a hold on people coming in from countries with strong terrorist ties. I don't endorse a permanent ban, and that's not what was imposed.
2. Yes, there are muslims in those countries. The 5 most populated Muslim countries were NOT in the list of banned countries. BUT the reality is, the vast majority of terrorist attacks worldwide are being carried out by extremists of Muslim/Islam faith. I am not saying all terrorists are muslims OR that all muslims are terrorists, but at some point we have to stop with the PC and do what's necessary to protect American lives. France is a prime example of what could happen.
3. I do not support a permanent ban of foreign citizens, and the current ban could certainly have been done better, but in 2017 we are dealing with a different beast. We did not have to worry about terrorist attacks from refugees like we are seeing around the world now. The old vetting process needs updating to deal with TODAYS THREATS.


both of you have tons of actual information. Commend you both.

On point 2, re: France, thats a false equivalency, we do not have open borders with nations sharing our continent. No one is taking a train from the Honduras here without presenting papers. The greater point remains re: threats but the France/EU comparison is a false equivalency.
 
Still waiting for someone to tell me the shortcomings in our current vetting system and how they would improve it...
 
Respectfully, I don't think you understand the visa process. People from these countries already have to go through an extensive process just to obtain a visa to travel to the US. Foreign Service officers are looking to weed out people who will overstay their visa or are a possible threat to our safety. If you want to strengthen that process, I am willing to listen to ideas but you don't need to impose an arbitrary ban.
Also, don't be naive enough to think this isn't a Muslim ban with Trump throwing red meat to his base. He asked Rudy Giuliani way back during the campaign to create a commission to find a legal way to ban Muslims. Rudy volunteered this information in an interview on Fox because he is also an egomaniac and wanted to brag about it on Fox.

No I know the process very well. The process is there for a reason! You can argue what Giuliani said but that isn't what he wrote in the executive order. He could have and didn't.

Politician have turned the other way risking safety and security of our nation for far too long and it's about damn time we are doing something about it.

As for ideas, here's one... Do away with the IRS (go to a flat tax system) & cross trained all of the agents to work with ICE to process applications. That way they don't lose their jobs and it's speeds up the process for those who wish to come here legally. It'll also give us more eyes for those who wish to come here and do us harm.

Also Foreign Service Officers aren't the one who weed out immigration applications unless you're referencing those with terrorist ties. I don't think you made that mistake on purpose but I thought it was funny none the less.
 
How does one vet someone from a country with practically no records?

Pretty much everyone is missing this key facet.

For one, I would urge everyone to go to the State Department website and actually read the description of the "vetting" process for legal immigration to the U.S. Also, go find testimonials and biopics of refugees own experience going through this process.

As it stands today, the current protocol for identifying, vetting, and permitting a refugee from Syria or Muslim immigrant from any of these countries is as good as it can be. Part of this is due to the fact that most of these countries lack even a fraction of the data infrastructure that countries like Saudi Arabia possesses so there's no easy way to simply search criminal records or known affiliates. All of this has to be done by ferocious and meticulous groundwork including multiple rounds of interviews and on-the-ground background checks of their families and closest circles. Even after they have cleared these hurdles the foreign-based immigration portals then refer the names and information to the State Department, the Department of Homeland Security, the Counterterrorism Center, and the FBI for further checking. With all of that power, you are going to tell me that we can't find one liver of reason to think someone is a terrorist but we are still going to block them from escaping literal hell?

Someone else has mentioned it, but all this was a show of power to his constituents that he will do what he said he was going to do. I can all but assure you that no changes will be made to the vetting process after this temporary "ban" (and I put that in quotations because Trump himself called it a ban) but pro-Trumpers will say he got stuff done. Right.

All in all here are two things that are the most outwardly idiotic things regarding this EO:
1) It is now widely known that the EO was crafted and put in place by Trump's inner circle of Bannon, Miller, and Kelly. Cite whatever articles you want, but the DHS, State Department, and OLC were not in on this EO and that violates every protocol in place. Trump's inner circle are very green at how the bureaucratic process works and they are going to have to conform to it.
2) The exclusion of Saudi Arabia alone from this EO is a clear indication of how Trump and his administration view the Arab world. Saudi Arabia sponsors and supports just as much radical Islamic terrorism as Iran or any other country. But, because they are the oil kings we don't dare upset the balance with them. Saudi Arabia is the most violating oligarchy in the world and incur some of the most severe human rights abuses. However, they sit on the UN human rights watch - what a f*cking joke.

On a personal note, I am the grandson of a Holocaust survivor. At age 11, my grandpa watched the Nazi SS lock his family in their house and burn it to the ground. The only survivors were he and his brother (for which I am the namesake). For 3 years, they hid out in the woods of Poland and joined the resistance. Pre-teens spent day in night in fear for their lives but worked to undo the evil that followed them. They ambushed patrols and blew up railcars. Finally, after my namesake's death, my grandpa had a chance to come to America to join some of his family who had made it here before the war. He went through Ellis Island, he went through a sponsorship program, he went to school, he served in the Marines, and he became both a lawyer and CPA. Today, he has 5 children and 13 grandchildren and 2 great-grandchildren - something he never could have imagined he would live to see. When he immigrated to the U.S., there was no vetting process outside of a medical exam. He could have just a likely been a German or Russian spy. But America has never turned away those who are in need and he found a happy and full life after horror. Today, we have the tools to vet, we have the tools to ensure the safety of our own citizens. Who is Donald Trump to deny safe haven and prosperous life to those who are in a similar situation as my grandfather was?
 
I disagree... here's why! The executive order was an immigration ban on countries that produce a higher than usual likelihood for terrorist infiltration into the United States. It's not a full immigration ban nor is it a Muslim immigration ban. It's precautionary ban until such people can be thoroughly vetted. Even the U.S. constitution grants the president power to make this happen.

"The order bars people from Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen from traveling to the U.S. for 90 days, raising serious questions from some on the Left as to whether the action is even constitutional. Already, more than a half-dozen lawsuits have been filed in opposition to the order, including challenges by the ACLU and the Council on American-Islamic Relations, CNN reported."

"As for the order not including majority Muslim countries such as the UAE, Van Spakovsky pointed out the governments in those countries are able to work with the U.S. to thoroughly vet immigrants applying for American visas. That’s not the case with the countries included in Trump’s order."

When CAIR (Muslim Brotherhood) wants to fight it you know you have them by the short hairs.

That is the problem with people like you. You don't let pure emotion and "fake" information/news/commercials/propaganda sway you or your convictions like most people in the US. Stop providing facts and rational thought on this board or you may be torn to shreds. Good job! ;-)
 
Pretty much everyone is missing this key facet.

For one, I would urge everyone to go to the State Department website and actually read the description of the "vetting" process for legal immigration to the U.S. Also, go find testimonials and biopics of refugees own experience going through this process.

As it stands today, the current protocol for identifying, vetting, and permitting a refugee from Syria or Muslim immigrant from any of these countries is as good as it can be. Part of this is due to the fact that most of these countries lack even a fraction of the data infrastructure that countries like Saudi Arabia possesses so there's no easy way to simply search criminal records or known affiliates. All of this has to be done by ferocious and meticulous groundwork including multiple rounds of interviews and on-the-ground background checks of their families and closest circles. Even after they have cleared these hurdles the foreign-based immigration portals then refer the names and information to the State Department, the Department of Homeland Security, the Counterterrorism Center, and the FBI for further checking. With all of that power, you are going to tell me that we can't find one liver of reason to think someone is a terrorist but we are still going to block them from escaping literal hell?

Someone else has mentioned it, but all this was a show of power to his constituents that he will do what he said he was going to do. I can all but assure you that no changes will be made to the vetting process after this temporary "ban" (and I put that in quotations because Trump himself called it a ban) but pro-Trumpers will say he got stuff done. Right.

All in all here are two things that are the most outwardly idiotic things regarding this EO:
1) It is now widely known that the EO was crafted and put in place by Trump's inner circle of Bannon, Miller, and Kelly. Cite whatever articles you want, but the DHS, State Department, and OLC were not in on this EO and that violates every protocol in place. Trump's inner circle are very green at how the bureaucratic process works and they are going to have to conform to it.
2) The exclusion of Saudi Arabia alone from this EO is a clear indication of how Trump and his administration view the Arab world. Saudi Arabia sponsors and supports just as much radical Islamic terrorism as Iran or any other country. But, because they are the oil kings we don't dare upset the balance with them. Saudi Arabia is the most violating oligarchy in the world and incur some of the most severe human rights abuses. However, they sit on the UN human rights watch - what a f*cking joke.

On a personal note, I am the grandson of a Holocaust survivor. At age 11, my grandpa watched the Nazi SS lock his family in their house and burn it to the ground. The only survivors were he and his brother (for which I am the namesake). For 3 years, they hid out in the woods of Poland and joined the resistance. Pre-teens spent day in night in fear for their lives but worked to undo the evil that followed them. They ambushed patrols and blew up railcars. Finally, after my namesake's death, my grandpa had a chance to come to America to join some of his family who had made it here before the war. He went through Ellis Island, he went through a sponsorship program, he went to school, he served in the Marines, and he became both a lawyer and CPA. Today, he has 5 children and 13 grandchildren and 2 great-grandchildren - something he never could have imagined he would live to see. When he immigrated to the U.S., there was no vetting process outside of a medical exam. He could have just a likely been a German or Russian spy. But America has never turned away those who are in need and he found a happy and full life after horror. Today, we have the tools to vet, we have the tools to ensure the safety of our own citizens. Who is Donald Trump to deny safe haven and prosperous life to those who are in a similar situation as my grandfather was?

I disagree with some, some mind you, about what you said. However, what a tragic, yet inspiring, story about your Grandfather. I think you would agree it is a different time here in America. Now, like never before, we have constant threats by people who are in street clothes that want to kill innocent civilians. Their very mission is to create fear and wreak havoc. Not to mention it's been awhile since America reached out to other countries asking for their tired, weak, poor, etc. Nonetheless, hearing stories like the one you mentioned, as well as others I have been fortunate to hear, is why I am completely open to people getting a chance at a better life in this country. I just want them to do it legally. That's all. I don't know enough about what Trump has instituted to speak intelligently about it. But, I know that a lot of these people, the people committed to terrorism are already here, in this country. Pretty scary times, brother. But, I'm glad you're here. It's what it's all about.
 
In today's world, a temporary pause (90 days on all,120 days on Syrian) in allowing thousands of un-vetted or lightly vetted people from all over the planet into our country while we figure out the best way to vet these folks, is hardly the same thing as Adolphus Busch coming in legally in the late 1800's. Not even close.
 
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I disagree with some, some mind you, about what you said. However, what a tragic, yet inspiring, story about your Grandfather. I think you would agree it is a different time here in America. Now, like never before, we have constant threats by people who are in street clothes that want to kill innocent civilians. Their very mission is to create fear and wreak havoc. Not to mention it's been awhile since America reached out to other countries asking for their tired, weak, poor, etc. Nonetheless, hearing stories like the one you mentioned, as well as others I have been fortunate to hear, is why I am completely open to people getting a chance at a better life in this country. I just want them to do it legally. That's all. I don't know enough about what Trump has instituted to speak intelligently about it. But, I know that a lot of these people, the people committed to terrorism are already here, in this country. Pretty scary times, brother. But, I'm glad you're here. It's what it's all about.

I agree with you. There is no doubt that there is an entire sub-population of a religion who believes their sole purpose it to kill and subjugate anyone who does not follow the same belief system. This is not all Muslims. I am all for legal immigration to this country. But I do not believe we should deny the process of legal immigration to those who need it. That goes for both people in the Middle East and south of our border. Come to this country through legal means and I will welcome you with open arms and be happy to sit next to you at the next Canes game.
 
In today's world, a temporary pause (90 days on all,120 days on Syrian) in allowing thousands of un-vetted or lightly vetted people from all over the planet into our country while we figure out the best way to vet these folks, is hardly the same thing as Adolphus Busch coming in legally in the late 1800's. Not even close.
We re-evaluate our sales focus weekly at work and ensure what we're doing still applies today and for next week. The world has changed drastically and this countries government needs to reevaluate how we protect it.

AND we are not the only country capable of taking in those escaping oppression. The temporary ban into the US from 5 terrorist harboring countries is not the end of the road for people.
 
I agree with you. There is no doubt that there is an entire sub-population of a religion who believes their sole purpose it to kill and subjugate anyone who does not follow the same belief system. This is not all Muslims. I am all for legal immigration to this country. But I do not believe we should deny the process of legal immigration to those who need it. That goes for both people in the Middle East and south of our border. Come to this country through legal means and I will welcome you with open arms and be happy to sit next to you at the next Canes game.

Yep. But too many people are saying this is not a ban, just allowing a more thorough process. Again, not looking for a debate cause I admittedly don't know enough about it, but I don't have a problem with investigating people from hostile countries more than others. Let me say this too; I am half Syrian!! Though you would never know it to look at me as I take after my German roots as far as appearance goes. Lol! However, I have NO problems with looking into Syrians who may want to come here a little more than others from other countries. I don't find that offensive, I find it reasonable. If the government decides they want to look into me because of my heritage I'd let them. I have nothing to hide whatsoever. It's a tough time for America because people hate us for the very things that are so sought after. It might be time to be more cautious than we have been in the past.
 
Yep. But too many people are saying this is not a ban, just allowing a more thorough process. Again, not looking for a debate cause I admittedly don't know enough about it, but I don't have a problem with investigating people from hostile countries more than others. Let me say this too; I am half Syrian!! Though you would never know it to look at me as I take after my German roots as far as appearance goes. Lol! However, I have NO problems with looking into Syrians who may want to come here a little more than others from other countries. I don't find that offensive, I find it reasonable. If the government decides they want to look into me because of my heritage I'd let them. I have nothing to hide whatsoever. It's a tough time for America because people hate us for the very things that are so sought after. It might be time to be more cautious than we have been in the past.
Great points! I fly weekly for work and it amazes me the people frustrated with getting their bags searched or being searched. Safeguards are necessary to protect citizens of this country. Citizens that some want to kill. And the TSA needs an overhaul too while we're at it. I don't like the feeling that I have in TSA currently considering I fly as much as I do. And that feeling is zero faith in their abilities to stop serious and calculated threats.
 
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This thread was an epic troll job.

No, there were no tears during the Super Bowl during that commercial. That was hyperbole lol... My best friend got engaged so we were actually in full celebration mode.

Yes, the Executive Order is likely to upheld as improper.

Yes, the Executive Order should be modified and better articulated when rolled out.

Yes, we need extreme vetting policies but policies which are still consistent with our traditional American values of welcoming immigrants/refugees without sacrificing both the welfare and safety of the people. I think that is fair.

Overall, the Executive Order was sloppy. Sloppy both procedurally and in substance. But I firmly believe in the overall thrust in what President Trump is doing on the refugee issue. Just need to tighten it up a little.

I appreciate all the replies.
 
I disagree with some, some mind you, about what you said. However, what a tragic, yet inspiring, story about your Grandfather. I think you would agree it is a different time here in America. Now, like never before, we have constant threats by people who are in street clothes that want to kill innocent civilians. Their very mission is to create fear and wreak havoc. Not to mention it's been awhile since America reached out to other countries asking for their tired, weak, poor, etc. Nonetheless, hearing stories like the one you mentioned, as well as others I have been fortunate to hear, is why I am completely open to people getting a chance at a better life in this country. I just want them to do it legally. That's all. I don't know enough about what Trump has instituted to speak intelligently about it. But, I know that a lot of these people, the people committed to terrorism are already here, in this country. Pretty scary times, brother. But, I'm glad you're here. It's what it's all about.

Lots of honesty in your post. I would ask that you go back and check out Black Wall Street, Rosewood, Red Summer, Detroit 1943. Point being we've had constant threat of terror for folks in street clothes that wanted to kill innocent citizens for a long time. Actual terror has been happening to citizens of different communities for centuries here. That being said, we need to be vigilant but abrogating our principles is an erosion of our freedoms.
 
A beer commercial did away with your convictions? You're OK with letting in people from known terrorist havens without proper vetting because of a beer commercial? LOL

I guess you @canesrule21'ships @Azar @cems52 @GILL06 and @cdwright40 will be out protesting now....
No one is in favor of letting anybody in this country without thorough vetting. Another right wing lie.
 
This thread was an epic troll job.

No, there were no tears during the Super Bowl during that commercial. That was hyperbole lol... My best friend got engaged so we were actually in full celebration mode.

Yes, the Executive Order is likely to upheld as improper.

Yes, the Executive Order should be modified and better articulated when rolled out.

Yes, we need extreme vetting policies but policies which are still consistent with our traditional American values of welcoming immigrants/refugees without sacrificing both the welfare and safety of the people. I think that is fair.

Overall, the Executive Order was sloppy. Sloppy both procedurally and in substance. But I firmly believe in the overall thrust in what President Trump is doing on the refugee issue. Just need to tighten it up a little.

I appreciate all the replies.

Called it ya smart ass!
 
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Lots of honesty in your post. I would ask that you go back and check out Black Wall Street, Rosewood, Red Summer, Detroit 1943. Point being we've had constant threat of terror for folks in street clothes that wanted to kill innocent citizens for a long time. Actual terror has been happening to citizens of different communities for centuries here. That being said, we need to be vigilant but abrogating our principles is an erosion of our freedoms.

Too busy to check those things. Enlighten me; were any of the things you listed all in the name of a religion? Especially one of "peace"? Not trying to be a smart ass here but just asking a question.
 
Lots of honesty in your post. I would ask that you go back and check out Black Wall Street, Rosewood, Red Summer, Detroit 1943. Point being we've had constant threat of terror for folks in street clothes that wanted to kill innocent citizens for a long time. Actual terror has been happening to citizens of different communities for centuries here. That being said, we need to be vigilant but abrogating our principles is an erosion of our freedoms.

Okay, I looked at two as I am getting ready to take off to Baltimore (yay!!). Not saying that all the racism in this country isn't one of America's biggest sins. This has been going on, and still goes on, for years. It will continue to do so. Of course EVERYONE is capable of racism, and that is happening in greater numbers now. No argument from me. However, I would say what is going on in the name of religion is different. Maybe more determined (if you will) than your average racist piece of shit. I could be wrong and examining this through modern day glasses. But, I have never seen anything like this. These attacks are targeted at anyone who is free. It's unreal and these people need to be weeded out and destroyed. As should ANY AND ALL racists.
 
Funny all the liberal cockroaches run and hide as soon as someone starts spitting a little truth! Pussies
Truth? You righties wouldn't know the truth if it hit you in your azz. You have invented an alternative universe filled with lies, distortions and falsehoods. Nothing from the Trumpster's mouth is believable including his minions like U.
 
Truth? You righties wouldn't know the truth if it hit you in your azz. You have invented an alternative universe filled with lies, distortions and falsehoods. Nothing from the Trumpster's mouth is believable including his minions like U.
Invented nothing! You're literally making up sh#t and stating your opinion as fact. The executive order is online and you can read it for yourself.

I know immigration law fairly well and cross certified with ICE as a TFA. So you want to try that truth statement again?
 
Advarkas is right as usual we should be a magnanimous country open to all to share our resources and wealth. I would guess at least 100,000,000 people in the Middle East, Africa, Asia, Central and South America and Eastern Europe would jump at the opportunity to come here. The political party Socialist Democratic (formerly known as the Democratic Party) will be happy to pay for their transportation, medical, education, housing and living expenses with a new 90% tax on the middle class.

My God we live in a world of laws that spell out immigration procedures if you don't like them change it but stop the illegal immigrants now. Send them all to the country formerly known as Germany.
 
Invented nothing! You're literally making up sh#t and stating your opinion as fact. The executive order is online and you can read it for yourself.

I know immigration law fairly well and cross certified with ICE as a TFA. So you want to try that truth statement again?
What in my statement is not true? I only stated what everybody on the planet knows is this administration is filled with liars.
 
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In today's world, a temporary pause (90 days on all,120 days on Syrian) in allowing thousands of un-vetted or lightly vetted people from all over the planet into our country while we figure out the best way to vet these folks, is hardly the same thing as Adolphus Busch coming in legally in the late 1800's. Not even close.
I am glad I am not alone. This is exactly the case. Seven nations , all major shytholes without a functioning government or one that hates us, is what is at issue. The whole , why not Saudi Arabia etc , is a red herring argument. The Nations not included have functioning governments.
The head of the FBI and O'Bama's head of Intel all said the vetting was suspect .
The Judge was wrong. It was within his constitutional power and in line with statutes.
I'm a product of immigrants too. So is everyone else.
If I was Trump I would withdraw the order and issue a new one , specifying new enhanced vetting practices for these 7 nations. Then let the AG's litigate that.
I am disappointed with AJ. He must not have read the Judges opinion . He cites no authority to conclude that the AG's would likely prevail.
 
Still waiting....

As I suspected, no body here knows wtf they are talking about. Trump has trolled all of you and prayed on your fears.
 
Okay, I looked at two as I am getting ready to take off to Baltimore (yay!!). Not saying that all the racism in this country isn't one of America's biggest sins. This has been going on, and still goes on, for years. It will continue to do so. Of course EVERYONE is capable of racism, and that is happening in greater numbers now. No argument from me. However, I would say what is going on in the name of religion is different. Maybe more determined (if you will) than your average racist piece of shit. I could be wrong and examining this through modern day glasses. But, I have never seen anything like this. These attacks are targeted at anyone who is free. It's unreal and these people need to be weeded out and destroyed. As should ANY AND ALL racists.

Sorry if I wasn't clear, those were incidents of specific terror, domestic terror. It still happens. I was only pointing out that when we say this is somehow different than when immigrants in the past came, that those immigrants or the children of those immigrants on occasion also engaged in terror.

For the record, I'm all for the end of all terror. No place for terror domestic, foreign, religious or otherwise in this world.
 
Advarkas is right as usual we should be a magnanimous country open to all to share our resources and wealth. I would guess at least 100,000,000 people in the Middle East, Africa, Asia, Central and South America and Eastern Europe would jump at the opportunity to come here. The political party Socialist Democratic (formerly known as the Democratic Party) will be happy to pay for their transportation, medical, education, housing and living expenses with a new 90% tax on the middle class.

My God we live in a world of laws that spell out immigration procedures if you don't like them change it but stop the illegal immigrants now. Send them all to the country formerly known as Germany.


Are you showing examples of misinformation or lack of understanding in your post? I didn't see anyone talking about illegal immigration. I thought this was about refugees that were accepted by the US which is fairly antithetical to the concept of illegal immigration.
 
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Too busy to check those things. Enlighten me; were any of the things you listed all in the name of a religion? Especially one of "peace"? Not trying to be a smart ass here but just asking a question.

Not that I'm aware of, I wasn't addressing religion, I've been told that this is not a religious ban or test. Was I wrong?
 
That Super Bowl Commercial just now- the Budweiser one, that features Adolphus Busch coming from Deutschland.

It broght tears to my eyes. I cried when I saw it, amd I'm not afraid to say it. I've been thinking about it and I admit that the Democrats are right. We Republicans are wrong. Trump is wrong for that Executive Order.

Thank you.

The Courts are right.

Prost! (Cheers!)

Go and protest anything! You can BS better than the average libtard!
 
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It's not an anti immigrant EO AJ it's a pro active national security one don't be fooled by these liberals we gotta stick up for him and not be whobolly on the right
 
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The Trump ban is only dealing with legal immigration, not illegal immigration. This has nothing to do illegal immigration.
The Trump ban affects people who were legally allowed to come here. They all had visas or permission to come, which Trump attempted to change on his own.The President is allowed to set most policies in regards to immigration and visiting our country. The problem is that his Executive Order was not well thought out or planned. It was three guys sitting in the White House with Giuliani's assistance. They did not run it by any of the agencies who had to administer it nor allow anyone's else to tell them what they were doing is wrong. An example was Trump's exception for "minorities" from the seven countries. This was clearly a religious test. That is not allowed under the US Constitution. The restrictions on green card holders was another mistake. You cannot discriminate against them as they are legally allowed to be permanent residents.

So far, I believe that there are 9 court cases and all but one have ruled against Trump. He could have made a change in the policies and not had this problem. He should pull the policy, start over and do one that will be legal.
 
No I know the process very well. The process is there for a reason! You can argue what Giuliani said but that isn't what he wrote in the executive order. He could have and didn't.

Politician have turned the other way risking safety and security of our nation for far too long and it's about damn time we are doing something about it.

As for ideas, here's one... Do away with the IRS (go to a flat tax system) & cross trained all of the agents to work with ICE to process applications. That way they don't lose their jobs and it's speeds up the process for those who wish to come here legally. It'll also give us more eyes for those who wish to come here and do us harm.

Also Foreign Service Officers aren't the one who weed out immigration applications unless you're referencing those with terrorist ties. I don't think you made that mistake on purpose but I thought it was funny none the less.

Foreign Service officers do not deal with applications for immigration but I don't know what you are talking about. They don't apply for immigration applications, they apply for travel visas. There is a process where they sit for interviews and their background is checked and their reasoning for travel. If it is a tourist visa, the check has to also do with the chances they will overstay their visa. There is a long process when dealing with some of these questionable countries.
Applying for permanent status while in country is a total different situation and I'm guessing handled by ICE. Trump's order has to do with travel status and thus Visas. Maybe you should understand a little better what you are talking about but don't let the facts get in the way of your argument.
Don't know where you pulled IRS into the situation and that idea would be idiotic as they are used to dealing with anything in this arena.
 
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